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Tricky Questions

`Lies' & `Life' & `Worth' & `Myths'



From: "Ray D"
Subject: Re: Games and fairytales
Date: Sun, 21 May 2006 19:11:36 +0100

----- Original Message -----
From: "Tim Chapman"
Sent: Sunday, May 21, 2006 11:36 AM
Subject: Games and fairytales

> http://observer.guardian.co.uk/uk_news/story/0,,1779820,00.html > > Study downplays link of video games to violence


Seems to be mainly obfuscation and misdirection Tim,

Obviously one could cite a `game' which was "slow" and "thoughtful" and say that wouldn't harm people.

Unfortunately most games aren't like that.  They _need_ to be addictive therefore they need to be fast.
[If you don't know how those two hang together try << consciousness examined >> in Google.com]

And *fast* means destructive and degenerative for human brains (IMHO), especially for young males.

BTW - At least two major western gov'ts have an interest in increasing male stupidity.

And we should always be aware that billions of dollars of corporate money hang on these surveys.  Therefore they are mostly bent.

And if one isn't?  The BBC has a tame "expert" who'll diss it without taking the trouble to read it! www.perceptions.couk.com/violence7.txt

That should tell us something about the BBC and its corporate allegiances.

If not convinced - remember the "Battle of the Beanfield"?  www.perceptions.couk.com/crapbbc.html#j-int
everybody today pretends to be mystified about what happened.

Well, was in a pub with a Welsh village copper who'd been drafted into that bunch of (mostly city-police) thugs.

Even years later he was still disgusted at what those "Maggy's Boys" did.

They had the BBC cameras switched OFF while they, the city cops, were shouting obscenities and flinging stones and muck and dogshit at the travellers' children - until the travellers were enraged enough (and wouldn't you be?) to fight back.

Then ON came the BBC cameras, and made it look like an "unprovoked attack" on honest policemen - instead of a deserved reply to scum in uniform.

And my Welsh copper pal knew it - and hated it.

But we should have known.  The BBC routinely filmed the police fights with miners in Wales and Yorkshire - but played the sequences in REVERSE.  So police taunts and attacks were shown as if in RESPONSE to a later defence move by the miners.

The BBC has a lot to explain - and a lot still invested in corruption and violence.  And they seem to _want_ a lost next generation.

cheers
Ray D






Life Probabilities?



From: "Ray D"
Subject: Re: Re: [Tyanaeus] Not-so-junky DNA
Date: Sat, 20 May 2006 07:45:48 +0100
----- Original Message -----
From: "Charles W"
Sent: Saturday, May 20, 2006 6:03 AM
Subject: Re:[Tyanaeus] Not-so-junky DNA

> I'm a trained mathematician and have no trouble at all dealing
> with infinity.  In fact, I can even see that there are different
> orders of infinity (cardinality).  For instance, the set of
> integers is smaller than the set of points on a line, even
> though both are infinite.  Care to discuss calculus? -CW


Hi Charles,
got a small question here, since everyone so far is talking of _organic_ life.

We (organics) are basically patterns, it's just that we use carbon based building blocks (our bodies and `food') to carry and pass on those physical and `mental' patterns (DNA and our handed-on `personalities').

Like Boris was maybe hinting, it's possible that `living' patterns in energy got established way before life on Earth.  It could've happened right at the start.  Some simple examples we've recently found down on Earth - like the BZ cycles in chemicals say - but see no reason it coundn't've gotten really complex, long-lasting, and big, elsewhere.

Quote that might apply -

"Such patterns are likely to arise in any dynamical system with suitable features ... spatial extension, a particular type of oscillatory local dynamic, and coupling rules for how one region influences its neighbors ....

These phenomena do not depend on detailed properties of the underlying setup, such as which chemicals you use or even whether you use chemicals at all.  They depend on certain universals .. - spacial distribution; local oscillations; certain kinds of short range coupling."


- from Profs Cohen and Stewart in `Collapse of Chaos'

Sounds to me as if pattern-carrying (life) doesn't have to only use short-lived organic bodies but could use electromagnetic fields, maybe even more weird arrangements.

So, if such living-patterns exist, would / or could we be aware of them?

And maybe much more important, would they be aware of us?

cheers
Ray D




From: "Ray D"
Subject: Re: (Tyanaeus) Not-so-junky DNA
Date: Sat, 20 May 2006 21:56:36 +0100

----- Original Message -----
From: "Charles W"
Sent: Saturday, May 20, 2006 4:18 PM
Subject: Re: Re: [Tyanaeus] Not-so-junky DNA

> That's a fascinating concept and may be the key to understanding
> paranormal phenomema.  Self-sustaining energy patterns could be a
> biproduct of organic life (e.g. ghosts) or even a precursor
> (souls).  Given the electrical processes in the brain, it is
> possible such entities could be the carriers of intelligence.

> Awareness may not be possible to determine unless there is some kind of communication.

> I'm going to need to check out Cohen and Stewart.


Stewart is math prof, Cohen is biology I think - they've teamed up to write several books but more interesting - they'll act as advisors for some SciFi writers and sometimes go to the States for get-together and hangout with group for brain-busting sessions on what's feasible, possible, likely or crazy.  They've come up with variations on life possibilities, including gas-filled `balloon grazers' and predators on Jupiter-like planets, or even plasma-life in skins of stars.  Apparently quite a few sci-fi books' life-forms were invented in these sessions.

Cohen once had a pet squid or octopus who could recognize different humans and knew which games they liked to play - pretty good for a short lived sea animal.

cheers
Ray D

PS - only once chatted with Stewart, he's a friendly type - keeps his emails short and witty.






Animal Consciousness



From: "Ray D"
Subject: Re: FWD (SK) Crow assembly calls ? [new subj]
Date: Mon, 22 May 2006 18:56:18 +0100

----- Original Message -----
From: "Steve B"
Sent: Monday, May 22, 2006 2:28 PM
Subject: Re: FWD (SK) Crow assembly calls ? [new subj]

>> The beaches of Marin and San Francisco are great places to hang out with
>> them too.  Lots of ravens hanging in the air like gulls while
>> they scout the beaches for snacks.  (Robin tells me that ravens are the
>> only crows who can glide--something about their wing shape/size.)

> This isn't true.
> Choughs can certainly glide, and are the most spectacular
> aerobats of all the crow family.
> Rooks also glide - the ones from the rookery at the end of our
> road routinely play on the wind on windy days,


single instance -

walking west towards Fitful Head (Shetland Mainland) you have to go inland and up, crossing exposed flattish grassy watershed with traces of old stone cottage / farm houses occasionally poking out of the peaty ground.  Windy most days, maritime squalls passing over.

Soon after leaving the bay-shore, a solitary crow would croak (a greeting?) and soar close overhead, sticking with me, gliding into strongish wind, until i either climbed Fitful - and got attacked by noisy gulls and fulmars, or descended to Garth's Ness and the cliffs of the `cauldron' where sea-birds ruled again.  That crow seemed lonely - probably only saw a human once in a while, but kept to its limited area.

[ << High tide filling up the "cauldron" >> in Google.com shud get some photos - final shot caught one of those malignant fulmars - they seem to aim for your eyes when you're hanging onto a cliff-face]

BTW - in that kind of sparse landscape, and where the animals or birds appear alone or in twos / threes - the individual's personality tends to become more apparent.  Might explain some of those anthropomorphic Nordic legends - of seals, birds etc.

cheers
Ray D






`Worth' measured solely as `possessions'.



From: "Ray D"
Subject: End of alien rule?
Date: Tue, 23 May 2006 02:42:05 +0100

http://www.kurzweilai.net/meme/frame.html?main=/articles/art0673.html
> Most students of artificial intelligence are familiar with this
> forecast made by Vernor Vinge in 19931: "Within thirty years, we
> will have the technological means to create superhuman
> intelligence.  Shortly after, the human era will be ended."


Well, it's possible.  Given the intellectual state of our rulers - greedy, primitive, luxury-loving and pervert - ownership of AI (artificial intelligences) will be like kids playing with loaded guns.

Looks like we're coming up to another evolutionary decision point.  We might even have to insist that our rulers are _human_ henceforth.

But that's a big change - and the aliens might lash out.

cheers
Ray D




From: "Ray D"
Date: Tue, 23 May 2006 10:42:37 +0100
Subject: [Tyanaeus] Re: Singularity is inevitable ? [new subj]

----- Original Message -----
From: "Terry W. C"
Sent: Tuesday, May 23, 2006 5:03 AM
Subject: Re: Singularity is inevitable ? [new subj]
http://home.tiac.net/~cri/1996/making.html
> It explains IMO a very plausible alternative scenario for what
> can happen, more succinctly than I have managed to so far, and
> perhaps in sufficiently science-fictiony terms that even a
> transhumanist might give it some consideration before dismissing
> it as leftist propoganda.  Which it absolutely is not.

> He leaves out a massive reduction in population, on the order of
> 90%, and the likely destruction of a substantial fraction of the
> infrastructure in the wars you can expect.

> It surely wouldn't be an Extropian future.

> Keith H


Seems he's a little consumption-biased, his words -

"Thus, the future: Agricultural, totalitarian, socialistic, literate, fragments of technology preserved, efficient medicine and production of basic necessities, essentially static but internationally anarchistic.  The population will be about the same as now.  The standard of living will be sharply lower in what are now the industrialized nations and higher in todays underdeveloped countries.  The future in a word: impoverished"

- are the words of a spoiled child.

And he's not alone, almost all western `leaders' are similarly obsessed with conspicuous consumption - for themselves.

Reason?

They _need_ the ridiculous trappings of power and its stolen wealth, because they have nothing else.

Measure them rationally, as people - they're worthless!

cheers
Ray D

[maybe try P.6 of `Altruist Survivor']




From: "Ray D"
Date: Thu, 1 Jun 2006 09:05:54 +0100


Ha! - "News" this a.m. - "Democrats for Greed"'s Left Wing (i.e the Conservative Party), has agreed with its Right Wing (`New Labour' Party) -

[George Osborne, while in opposition, had said he was in favour of a `flat tax' because it was cheaper and fairer, but now he says ...]- that a FLAT TAX - first made a stab at by USA some years ago, and now being adopted by many Eastern European countries (because it's simplest, cheapest to administrate and FAIREST)

- is WRONG for UK!  They said "it's too difficult."

What happened: owners of both main UK parties - the rich - refused to pay fair (equal) taxes.

cheers
Ray D

Nb - all MPs (Congressmen) automatically become rich - non-net-taxpayers - when they take their first pay packet from poorer people's taxes.

1 - situation outlined at `taxey' - opposing lies from the _same_ politicians.

2 - resulting effects in UK life for families

3 - resulting effects among UK children

4 - the broadbrush picture

5 - latest (Mar 2011) `Budget' - more lies




From: Stewart S Date: Thu, 01 Jun 2006 09:20:04 +0100 Subject: Re: "Too difficult for UK" - USA & East EU's Flat Tax

Apparently the present tax system is too difficult for them as well judging by the tax credits fiasco.

You spend all the money administrating a system where people get some of their tax paid back but if their income changes over the year they end up being overpaid and chased by the taxman for the cash back.

Alternatively you could just lower taxes...

And people actually want Prudence to take over after Blair.

Stew





From: "Doc" Date: Sat, 17 Jun 2006 11:35:09 -0000 Subject: Re: "Too difficult for UK" - USA & East EU's Flat Tax

There's actually another trick you can pull here, which is even nicer than lowering taxes.

What you do is work out what someone on minimum wage, full time, will earn in a year, and peg the basic tax-free allowance to that figure.  That way, the very poorest people pay no income tax at all.

Collecting tax is costly to the government.  Paying said tax back via tax credits is also costly, bureaucratic and overly-complex; conplex enough that the Government have yet to get it right.

Not collecting tax is much easier, cheaper to administer, and does the same as tax credits, more or less.





Date: Wed, 11 Jul 2007 20:02:30 +0100
Subject: Nepal stops paying all allowances to King

news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/south_asia/6293062.stm

"Nepal's government has decided to stop paying all allowances to King Gyanendra and other senior royals, reports say."
...
"He has been forced to pay tax for the first time, and ordered to keep a low profile, as well as being barred from traditional ceremonial duties such as gracing religious functions."


Well, well - what about UK where the poorest people are paying a 60% tax burden [mostly `invisible' taxes like Nat Ins / VAT / Council Tax] - to support the rich (who pay max of 10% tax) and the royals (virtually no tax)??

cheers
Ray D






Set-ups? - Recent




From: "Ray D"
Date: Sat, 3 Jun 2006 09:18:42 +0100
Subject: Is it all a SET-UP?


Thanks to Sean McBride of CTRL Grp

>Indignant French officials accused MI5 of helping the cleric to
>abscond.  While he remained on the run, one intelligence chief in
>Paris was quoted as saying: "British intelligence is saying they
>have no idea where he is, but we know where he is and, if we
>know, I'm quite sure they do."


>Almost a year later Abu Qatada was found hiding in a flat not
>far from Scotland Yard.


http://tinyurl.com/ewxvy

---

Well, well.

As, for me the evidence says that most N Ireland `atrocities' were MI5 (& NI Police) set-ups to justify continued scam - skimming millions, maybe billions over the years, in "security / informant payments" -

[see Reports on Police \ Submissions \ Stalker enquiry - all necessarily v. tactful, people are still being assassinated for revealing too much]

- this item raises similar question over the whole "war on terror" - also backed up by a stark fact: most violence & terror is used BY gov'ts AGAINST citizens.

cheers
Ray D





Jews in Kashmir?



From: "Ray D"
Subject: Re: Jessos in Hindostan--was Re: Re: [Anglican] Film: The Da Vinci Code
Date: Sun, 21 May 2006 17:48:32 +0100

----- Original Message ----- From: "T. Peter P"
Sent: Sunday, May 21, 2006 5:25 PM
Subject: Jessos in Hindostan--was Re: Re: [Anglican] Film: The Da Vinci Code

> The one tidbit I remember most from reading _Jesus Died in
> Kashmir_ some 20-odd years ago was the author's citing the
> popularity of Hebrew-derived names like Yusuf, Ibrahim, and
> Soleyman in Kashmir as proof that Jesus had been there preaching
> a Judaic religion.  The author had apparently never heard of
> Islam! :-) Or does the mention of Yusuf, Ibrahim, Suleyman, etc., in the Qur'an prove that Jesus died in Saudi Arabia? :-)


Hi T Peter,
you tripped a memory from `Bernier's Travels' and have just looked it up.  Bernier was there (Hindustan) in mid 1600's and wrote many letters and an account dedicated to King Louis (of France - for a while).  One of his chapter headings is "Jews in Kachemire".

On page 430 you find - "There are however, many signs of Judaism to be found in this country ... the Jewish appearance of these villagers having been remarked by our Jesuit Father, and by several other Europeans long before I visited Kachemire.

A second sign is the prevalence of the name of Moussa, which means Moses, among the inhabitants of this city, notwithstanding they are all Mahometans.

A third is the common tradition that Solomon visited this country, and that it was he who opened a passage for the waters by cutting the mountain of Baramoule.

A fourth, the belief that Moses died in the city of Kachemire, and that his tomb is within a league of it.

And a fifth may be found in the generally received opinion that the small and extremely ancient edifice seen on one of the high hills was built by Solomon; and it is therefore called the Throne of Solomon to this day"


Bernier goes on to note that evidence or actual history of Jews is known from Persia, Lar, and Hyspan; and in Hindustan towards Goa and Cochin.

cheers
Ray D

PS - as far as those Arabian names go - maybe we should recall that Hebrew and Arabic were recently the same language.
A Jew would say `Arabic is proto-Hebrew spoken harshly' while
an Arab would say `Hebrew is proto-Arabic spoken with a lisp'.

Truly family quarrels are the deadliest.
RD





Anthropology - The Rescue?




Date: Sat, 22 Jul 2006 13:54:09 +0100
Subject: Re: Interesting stuff re `Myth, Ritual ...


The wave of moralizing (and taxing) proselytizing (and immoral) `educating' (and ignorant), preaching (and murdering) colonizers and `explorers' was not uniform world-wide but it was - over about two centuries - uniquely overwhelming, in this cycle anyway.

By the time it was over even the still-hidden tribes (Amazonia & New Guinea inc.) knew of / had heard of * note 1 the white invaders - and were changing their `myths' accordingly.  But, up to the time of Buckle, Wallace, Lang (and Fort), the philologists dominated so-called `research' and had been the `history-writers' (for a thousand years or so).

Buckle, in his cutting attack on them, collected and showed the results:- `history' as given to the people was a meaningless farrago of propaganda and downright lies.  Anthropology didn't exist - what did exist was a joke.

The first true anthropologists, Lang and his contemporaries, set out to clean the stables, preserve the evidence free of propoganda, and begin forming realistic conclusions - in the face of opposition from the (mostly clerical) establishment.

Buckle, Wallace, Lang (and Fort) all faced similar oppositions, maybe because they were linked by similarities of backgrounds, views, interests and studies (in the widest sense).  Having strong intelligence, independence and the habits of truth-seeking and truth-telling, their views were probably bound to be unpopular among the `establishment' - and they were.

You should be able to understand my pessimism about the `contamination' of anthropological evidence, even that collected previously.  But you should notice (hopefully) that further insights, correlations and conclusions were not ruled out.

As a matter of fact, several folk (me included * note 2) are raking through original `myth' records and correlating those with modern archeological results, including impact data.  Latest to do that are Mike Baillie & Co (dendrochronology & ice-core stuff).

So, ... apart from `archeology', the best untainted evidence is assembled by Lang and contemporaries.  And, as Lang also supplied copious cross-references and summarized opposing views, that makes his `Myth, Ritual, ...' even more valuable, at any rate to me - who doesn't get to the British Library.

cheers
Ray D

PS -
Indexing being what it is, it's a good job we can do edit / find on-line in works of Wallace, Lang and Fort - Buckle's stuff is a bit elusive -

but see Hinde's Review of "Eckhardt Fuchs on Buckle"

also "Buckle in the Darwin Correspondence"

Buckle downloads available
(some are rough scans)

Searches for "Henry Thomas Buckle" will also turn up chess pages (he was a gifted amateur), and his notable speech on women's emancipation - "The Influence of Women on the Progress of Knowledge".




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